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Applying Democratic Ideals Abroad is Important; See Egypt (Cyrus)

Two weeks ago I attempted to give a brief account of how society, particularly American society, applies democratic ideals differently to domestic and foreign policy. You can read that post here.

I’m not sure I really succeeded at getting the point across. But now, in Egypt, we’ve been given a perfect example of what happens when the public disengages from their values and allows elites to run foreign policy. Johann Hari of The Independent explains (h/t 3QD):

“Very few British people would praise a murderer and sell him weapons. Very few British people would beat up a poor person in order to get cheaper petrol. But our governments do this abroad all the time. Of the three worst human rights abusers in the Middle East – Saudi Arabia, Israel, and Iran – two are our governments’ closest friends, showered with money, arms and praise.”

This is a beautifully visceral point, one that strikes a chord with many that hear it. It’s part of the reason why organizations like Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International exist, for when people realize their money is going toward heinous acts they try and counteract the damage done. But why do we find ourselves violating our own values?

Hari continues:

“British foreign policy does not follow the everyday moral principles of the British people, because it is not formulated by us. This might sound like an odd thing to say about a country that prides itself on being a democracy, but it is true. The former Labour MP Lorna Fitzsimons spoke as a conference for Israel’s leaders last year and assured they didn’t have to worry about the British people’s growing opposition to their policies because ‘public opinion does not influence foreign policy in Britain. Foreign policy is an elite issue.’ This is repellent but right. It is formulated instead in the interests of elite forces – big business and their demand for access to resources, and influential sectional interest groups.”

He goes on to explain what those interests are. Read the whole article on Hari’s blog, here.

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5 responses to “Applying Democratic Ideals Abroad is Important; See Egypt (Cyrus)”

  1. Ruchira

    Johann Hari is one of the best young journalists writing today. And he is absolutely right. Governments all over the world have this tendency – one set of rules for us and another for “them.” Foreign policy based on self interest is the practice of all “realistic” governments. Human rights of non-citizens is not the concern when economic interests are involved. Remember our attitude towards South Africa under apartheid rules.
    Nehru, the first prime minister of India, tried in his idealistic way to instill a value of fairness both in his domestic and foreign policies. He is laughed at now for his unpragmatic ways. But India was a poor, cumbersome, newly independent and brutally partitioned nation trying to shake off the heavy burdens of colonial rule during Nehru’s days. It had very little influence in the world arena. It was punished severely by the US (at the behest of the recently departed British) for its reluctance to take sides in the cold war. India too has now entered the playground of significant players and some of its actions (turning a blind eye to the repressive regime in Burma for gaining access to its natural resources) have begun to mirror the self-serving actions of the west. Even then, India’s stance on Iran and the middle east remain far more honest and even handed. Also, India did not establish diplomatic relations with S. Africa until Nelson Mandela was released from jail and apartheid dismantled. That the plight of many Indians in India is pathetic, is another story.
    Citizens do take note however, of our government’s hypocrisy in formulating foreign policy. Just that when it comes to voting, except for some rabid supporters of Israel, most focus on local matters. The government knows that and counts on that lack of attention to policies affecting far-away lands. I posted some letters to the editor in a recent issue of the Houston Chronicle. It is hard to say that everyone has wool over their eyes. Remember, Saddam Hussain too was once our “friend” when we thought he was good for maintaining “peace” in a troublesome region and keeping the oil flowing.

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  2. Elatia Harris

    Thank you, Cyrus! Tell us how it all feels and looks from Switzerland, please.

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  3. Norman Costa

    Cyrus,
    Thanks for the link to Hari’s article, We all helped suppress the Egyptians. So how do we change? I have not read him before, and I am very impressed with his thoughts and his writing.
    A few weeks ago I was listening to a radio interview with President Jimmy Carter. The Saudis, and others, punished the US for supporting Israel in the Yom Kippur war by cutting production of oil. [People still think the oil crisis had something to do with global economic issues or currency problems.] Carter was the first President in modern times to steer us in the direction of reducing our dependence on foreign oil. Imports were well over 50 percent foreign. He brought it down to well under 50 percent.
    Then came the Reagan years and imports went back up into the 60 percent range. When Gulf War II came along, the Saudis and others retaliated, again, and drove up the price of oil. It is still up.
    Shortly before the turn of the millennium, the US military (I think it was the Joint Chiefs) issued a report on prospects for war and peace in the new millennium. They said, as clearly as it can be stated, that energy was the single largest threat to peace for the United States. They said, as clearly as it can be stated, that efforts to resolve global energy needs was the only sure strategy for preventing wars.
    Then came the neocons, and Dunning-Kruger poster boy, ‘W.’ They were not going to wait for a solution to global energy needs. They were just going to grab it.
    So here we are, with high energy prices, a shitty economy, and revolution in the Middle East and Africa, and we were wondering, only days ago, how to keep our friend Hosni fat and happy. And now that revolution looks like it may get somewhere, we are afraid of people who are fighting for their own democracy. We think they are too stupid to see that they are being played by radical Islam so they can get back at the US.
    Someone, please, tell me we know what we are doing, and that it is going to get better. Cyrus, tell us a funny story, next time. I need a good laugh. Maybe everyone else does, too.

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  4. omar

    About the US role, I think the US administration includes people who are genuinely unhappy with being openly and totally associated with torturers and murderers. At the same time, their is a huge bureaucracy that has its own momentum regarding “stability” (in this case, its mostly Israel that is the issue, othewise the US has few worries about Egypt..the Suez canal is not a life and death issue for America). I dont think the US has a unified and clear policy in these matters. They can get surprised by events and they can over-react or under-react. They are not God. They are just people, mostly mediocre bureaucrats trying to cover their ass.
    Given the power of the Israeli lobby (decreasing now, but still very very powerful) the US is not going to stop interfering in the Middle East (Oil is an even bigger issue, but that is focused on the Gulf, SA, Iraq). But eventually the US may be replaced by China in some places, which has fewer problems with open thuggishness and torture. While other places will manage to grow up and run their own governments instead of being ruled by some thugs supported by USA or China. Egypt may be lucky enough to get to that point, but not in a straight line. Its probably going to be a rough ride. Egypt’s economy is not in great shape and population is rather large. Its going to be tough for secular democrats in such a setting. Sure, India has done it, but the historical background is very different..

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  5. Cyrus Hall

    Ruchira-
    There is a sub-set of America that takes notice of the hypocrisy of American actions, but it’s small. For those that do pay attention, voting often feels like pulling teeth. On most issues of foreign affairs, there is no major difference between the two parties. Yes, Iraq would have likely remained uninvaded with a Democrat in office, but the sanctions regime wasn’t particularly brilliant either, and I doubt that would have gone anywhere. Which party should I vote for to stop supporting of friendly dictators? Which party will stop making the life of the families of my Iranian friends hell with sanctions? Nothing says “we support you” like slowly strangling the economy of a country.
    Elatia-
    The view from here seems pretty much the same as the view from the States. The far-right is concerned about an Islamist state rising from the ashes of Cairo, while everyone else is supportive, or at least sympathetic, of a transition to democracy. The biggest difference is that the far-right controls far less here, so the fear of an Islamist state is more subdued. Most Europeans I know are cognizant that it would be hypocritical to support democracy at home and not abroad, even if that leads to governments who have different interests. Democracy in Europe is, in a some important ways, more idealistic than in America, even if its practice is often more constrained.
    Anyway, I’ve been following so much Al Jazeera and other international media that my view is probably pretty skewed. Everyone I know is supportive, although my Iranian friends were an initial exception. For them, the echo of ’79 was very strong. But they have come around as it has become obvious that the Brotherhood is neither out in front of the movement, nor has a large chance of controlling a new government.
    Norman-
    Not a lot of laughs coming from me right now. Sorry. :-)
    Thanks for the feedback everyone…it’s really too bad Hari doesn’t make it easy to comment on his blog, as he’s the one who is deserving!

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